Why

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oban
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Why

Post by oban » Mon Dec 31, 2018 4:31 pm

Since I have come here changes are being applied to some things that I don't understand. Like items being removed from vendors, Moogle buffs in the field, and now the primary leveling buffs removed. Long time players aren't going to care about these things as they don't likely effect them that much. But to folks like myself coming over in the last 6 months it's like a kick in the nuts. Help me understand the thinking. Leaving it as it was harms "KnowOne" (pun Intended), and the changes improve what? Were the moogle buffs not put into place to improve quality of life aspects? Why do you think Nasomi players love it when they come here?..... and then stay here..... Then why remove them? You already have a "mentor" option which is a fantastic idea! Because it's an option. Taking away things of this nature is exactly what I have seen occur just before other private servers take a dive. Especially when they are things exclusive to that server. I've played through four of them, and have already seen one player walk away due in part to this. There are reasons folks chose one server over another. Things that they appreciate. You have now removed enough of them to cause concern in my mind. I urge caution.


In the end this is your server to mold as you see fit. Dismiss these comments if you wish. Time will tell and your choices will prove me right or wrong.



Sonata
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Re: Why

Post by Sonata » Mon Dec 31, 2018 5:41 pm

While it doesn't really affect me since I am already 75 on all jobs, and I don't agree with the moogle buff exp buff being removed for QoL purposes, there is already a 4x increase in exp for normal characters as is. The reality of it is, the moogle exp buff was never meant to be permanent. It used to just be something that was turned on for a day or two on the weekends and then somewhere along the way they got lazy and stopped turning it on and off and it was left on permanently.

Moogle buffs in zones themselves were being abused in the sense that they weren't going away when zoning so they could be used against HNMs and other end game content. They were fixed some time ago so they would wear upon zone but it seems like an update somewhere along the way broke that functionality so people started abusing it again. Pretty sure they just refixed it so people wouldnt be going around with permanent refresh.

As far as the vending thing goes, I have no idea what has been removed from the custom vendors. The only ones that would make sense would be custom fish since fishing wasn't a thing when that vendor was implemented but is fully functional now, so someone else will have to clarify with that one.

Run_Away
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Re: Why

Post by Run_Away » Tue Jan 01, 2019 4:28 pm

The "primary leveling buffs" Was not fully removed. It was modified to be something for new players only. Prior to even removing it the Admins/GMs/Devs had a discussion about the Moogle stuff like it wasnt intended to be left in 100% mode (comments that stated 100% was for weekends only) That it was added due to server stability issues (which are no longer a issue).


Now I know some of you are confused by this but, all servers do changes to their game. Some that players love some that players do not. In regards to the exp buff while it was great it essentially turned our 4xp rate into 8xp rate due to everyone using the 100% buff. Thus the Admins/Devs/GMs decided that 8x is a bit much and instead of removing it completely that it would be modified to be for NEW players only. Thus new players will have a chance to get to end game faster but experienced players will have to put more time and effort into bringing multiple jobs to end game.

Ryzan
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Re: Why

Post by Ryzan » Tue Jan 01, 2019 6:29 pm

They never talk with players when it comes to something like that, because it was "intended" for something else or for a short period. Even though out of EVERYONE the GM's are literally the least effected by this. Quality of life should be important but consulting the player base on changes like this has never ever been a thing. ALOT of us tell them communication is key, because these changes effect us and barely them. But it falls on deaf ears, because they do all the work and we should be grateful, a GM literally said that YESTERDAY lol. I've tried to communicate that it goes BOTH ways, without us there would be no one to appreciate there hardwork at all, and yes that does mean we will criticize bad changes. Like this, is a bad change, regardless of its original intent, we've had it forever and it made us unique and everyone loved it. No one hated it, except for maybe the players with all 75's already and wanna scream BALANCE after they used and abused the system till they are content. In which case frankly they show EXTREME bias, and biased decisions are NEVER good ones. A good example of a change to that moogle buff would of been something Enko provided, making them equal to ring buffs or something similar. I hope for one day, the gms will sit down and be like you know what, without our players we wouldn't have a server we dedicate so much time to, maybe we should communicate big changes, but Era for almost the entire time I've been here, has never been that way. Its do and see what happens and if its not big enough, let it go.

Run_Away
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Re: Why

Post by Run_Away » Tue Jan 01, 2019 10:23 pm

"We have had it forever" Is not a reason to keep something! QoL is not a reason to avoid change! Things that were implemented a long time ago to make things possible were never meant to be the permanent solution. Things have to change on a server such as this due to advances in game conditions.

oban
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Re: Why

Post by oban » Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm

The long and short of it is this has been taken as a Huge Middle Finger toward your player base that appreciated the feature. We see no upside in any way for removing it. The reasoning of "it wasn't meant to stay" went out the window when it was left implemented for as long as it was. The great majority of the player base has never known anything else.

Before I joined I spoke with KnowOne and was assured that leveling here was significantly quick due to this very buff. The prospect of having to start leveling yet again on a new server was made more appealing and a smaller pill to swallow. I understand nobody forced me to join this server. That was my choice.

What I have seen happen though, is other server player basses being decimated by decision making in direct opposition to that of said players. For a prime example look at Gravenet for anyone who knows who that is. His server has at most 1-3 players if not zero at any given time now. When I started on it he had 45-50 with VERY few alts. You were just given about 10 new players from that server in recent months with the potential of more. (Thanks to Yuko btw) Don't make a fool of him.

But at this point there's no going back obviously. Anymore our requests/complaints/pleas will not be heard simply out of spite for how this change was received. I imagine the phrase "Back by Popular Demand" will not be seen. Just please heed this warning. Consider it when making decisions down the road. Your server will survive this one. But continue to dismiss your player base ...... well like I said in the original post...... I urge caution.

Run_Away
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Re: Why

Post by Run_Away » Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:32 pm

oban wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm
The long and short of it is this has been taken as a Huge Middle Finger toward your player base that appreciated the feature.
I am sorry you feel this way it was not intended to make anyone feel in such a way.
oban wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm
We see no upside in any way for removing it.
You see no upside in any way, However now with the feature gone players can focus on other aspects like farming EXP rings, that have gone unneeded to this point. Opening up other things to do that have more rewards than just EXP rings.
oban wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm
The reasoning of "it wasn't meant to stay" went out the window when it was left implemented for as long as it was. The great majority of the player base has never known anything else.
As I have stated " ""We have had it forever" Is not a reason to keep something!", Thus is why it is still available to *NEW* players.
oban wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm
Before I joined I spoke with KnowOne and was assured that leveling here was significantly quick due to this very buff. The prospect of having to start leveling yet again on a new server was made more appealing and a smaller pill to swallow. I understand nobody forced me to join this server. That was my choice.
As stated the feature is still available to *NEW* players thus it is still relevant to that point.
oban wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm
What I have seen happen though, is other server player basses being decimated by decision making in direct opposition to that of said players. For a prime example look at Gravenet for anyone who knows who that is. His server has at most 1-3 players if not zero at any given time now. When I started on it he had 45-50 with VERY few alts. You were just given about 10 new players from that server in recent months with the potential of more. (Thanks to Yuko btw) Don't make a fool of him.
I can give you an example of a change Nasomi did in regards to reducing leveling tactics where he made it so worms could move, despite this change the community still grew and found alternative means for levelings. Thus I understand what you are saying and its always a possibility that a server could die out from a tiny change that the players disagree with. However, in this case due to the buff only being about 5-25% of a standard parties exp, that can still be supplemented with exp rings, I myself highly doubt this minor change that actually opens the door to doing more things will be such a change. However, if you disagree you can choose to defy us to all means and be upset when other servers make changes you dont agree with as well.

oban wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:03 pm
But at this point there's no going back obviously. Anymore our requests/complaints/pleas will not be heard simply out of spite for how this change was received. I imagine the phrase "Back by Popular Demand" will not be seen. Just please heed this warning. Consider it when making decisions down the road. Your server will survive this one. But continue to dismiss your player base ...... well like I said in the original post...... I urge caution.
You are right about one thing many of the complaints were merely tossed aside due to gut reactions that had no actual bearing on giving critical feedback on the change just that it was a change that wasnt making things easier on the players.

And if you use that logic any change that doesnt make things easier (like adding abbysea or post 75 content to retail ;) ) than clearly not all changes that make things easier for the server is actually helping the server...


I would like to add that using the terms US, WE, THE PLAYERS, does not help your argument, in fact it just leads me to believe you are delusional because you seem to think that you represent all the players of the server... and well we both know that isnt true.

Now I have taken the time to read your argument and reply because despite how you feel about the change being a middle finger to YOU! I feel that given some time and actual critical thinking was used in your critique, it only fair to you. Where as players that got on to complain about something 5 mins after learning or hearing bad version of the change were simply acting out of emotion and not actually considering what the change really does.

Next I would like to add that along with removing said buff from players that no longer need the exp as much as a new player, that it opens doors to providing other buffs that we may not have granted given that exp bonus.... But, please go on about how your gut reaction to a change that slows you down from obtaining a Maat's cap by roughly 25% will have no upsides in ANY way. Or how changing a feature based on the never intended to be permanent or no longer a relevant buff based on why it was introduced in the first place is the worst thing to happen to a server and ALL the players feel insulted by it.

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Jedi
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Re: Why

Post by Jedi » Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:41 am

Might of been mentioned.

E X P Rings are now 99% more useful. Before you would only pop them when you were to lazy to warp back to town to remooglebuff.

You can obtain the normal EXP rings from gate guards and also replenish them by trading them to gate guards. Unique E X P rings cannot be replenished by gate guards (unless it was recently changed)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Unique EXP Rings.

Allied Rings have a 3% drop rate from every normal mob in La Vaule S. As a THF, you will obtain one pretty fast.
Anniversary Ring, Obtained from the NM of the week custom quest started in Rulude Gardens AH.
Kupofriend's Ring, obtained from helping a group complete Promy Vahzl if your character is already past that mission. You will have to trade the "Martial Ball Invite" you obtain from completing the Promy Vahlz BCNM Fight to the NPC "Tsugumi" in Rulude Gardens, who is pretty close to the MH entrance..

Anni and Kup give 100% exp rate which is the same as moogle buff. The Allied ring gives 150% rate. which is stronger... Couple of the gate guard rings give 75% I believe and the lesser one is 50%. So players still have options to BOOST their EXP rate. Newer players still get the exp buff from the moogle for their first lvl 75, so that's nice for new players not having to worry about exp rings the first go around. Most players level up thief first, which is the smart thing to do. Than you can go farm La Vaule S for some good loots. Theres plenty more that drops off those mobs than just the Allied Ring.

I'll add the EXP ring rant to my welcome to era guide. EXP rings were a fun idea Square Soft did correctly, I think this change is fine and people are overreacting. I overreacted a bit when I first heard about it. Once I took a breath and looked at all the information, it makes total sense. EXP rings are kind of fun to utilize and use in the game, and its not like we're taken away tons of exp away from players. The 4x is still here, and the exp rings increases it further acting as the Moogle Buff.

One fault. We could of made a post on the forums giving out information and a detailed reasoning to why the Admins made this decision, so the players would be able to see all the facts and information straight off the bat. I can take the bullet for that one, since iv been basically mia for a long time now.

oban
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Re: Why

Post by oban » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:24 am

Thanks for taking the time to read my post. My comments derive from experiences I have had. Shinra / Kupo / MHMU / Legion

What I have said does however come from "us" the "player base". It's being said, by many. So please hold your insults. They are not helpful nor well received.

Again, I urge caution when making bigger decisions. Which this was, as a significant part of the leveling experience here at ERA. Contrary to what I know you believe.

Anyone who knows me can tell you a Maat's cap is not a priority of mine (No, grinding exp for the 5th time doesn't exactly excite me). But developing friendships or even friendly rivalries is. Watching the servers I have enjoyed dissolve has been a great disappointment. Fear of that happening yet again is why I even made this thread. So please trust me when I say that angering the staff is not my intent. I especially do not wish to discourage you from continuing this body of work. Which it is. Work. That you all perform freely (donations aside). I'm sure threads such as this make you feel unappreciated. I understand that. What is said by me isn't meant to threaten or belittle. Only to hopefully give perspective. So I apologize if offense was taken.

I thank you for what you do. Understand that my only hope is that for once a server lasts.

I will not post again.

Ryzan
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Re: Why

Post by Ryzan » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:41 am

A gut reaction? Its not a gut reaction, its 100% true that there is no forseeable upside to you removing it. Your giving maybes and possibilities without actually giving any info, just basically "Trust us". Even though you guys don't communicate with the player base about big changes which should be a KEY thing, so how can we "trust you", and a HUGE portion of the player base lost their minds on this change, even now in social its goaded at. Thats why he said WE, don't play games and act like he is wrong and yes, us always having it because it was an extremely positive thing to the server, is a perfectly reasonable response to keeping it. EXP rings are not a good replacement, we now have to get them all because of no buff, and thats atleast 5 inventory spaces we need to use instead of just getting a buff that everyone enjoyed, not to mention some of the rings don't even last a half hour, and like I said this only hurts the new people. The problem here is that this is the only post, because most know it will make no difference, you gm's are like NO WE ARENT CHANGING IT BACK, and you really think people are gonna come in and voice an opinion when the gms straight don't care to talk about it lol. I will say it again, these decisions you guys make, effect US WAY more then it effects you and maybe JUST MAYBE, you should talk to your player base about huge changes. Will that happen? Probably not, Era has rarely/never done it, and will likely rarely/never do it.

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